4AGE engine tuning discussion

[novocaine]

In South Africa there are lots of modded 4age's and now seems to be the age of the 20V. Most of them concentrate on drag racing, and the power figures are impressive. I think that if you were here in South Africa and had a 2000 euro in zar, you could very easily build a 200HP 4age.

[Miguel - Newera]

Building a genuine 200 bhp N/A 4AGE isn't just a matter of putting together a pile of bits collected from Ebay, etc. To get a reliable 125 bhp / litre takes years of 4AGE race & engine building experience...

If this weren't the case, there would be more than just a handful of specialists in Japan that can produce such engines... How many AE86's with genuine 200 bhp N/A tuning have you ever seen for sale?

If you want relatively easy 4AGE N/A power get a 20V blacktop, put 304 11mm cams & race springs in, uprate the injectors, get a very high quality exhaust manifold, open throttles and get some decent mapping done with a good ECU and you may get a maximum of around 180 bhp at 9,500 rpm. But it's far from simple to do... Having a colleague who has recently completed his own blacktop 20V swap, I can confirm in his experience it wasn't that easy... Chosing the wrong parts water cooling / ignition / wiring loom modifications it quickly becomes a fairly expensive affair....

From the last 2-3 years of seeing 100's of AE86's tuned here in Japan - If I were trying to get relatively cheap & reliable power I'd go for a 20V blacktop..
But to get say 180 bhp as very briefly detailed above I'd expect to spend at least 6,000 Euros - including exhaust manifold, exhaust and a decent ECU.

As for engine swaps, etc. again it's also nowhere near as easy as it looks. People have run into all sorts of fitment / handling (Costly) headaches before even going into resolving other challenges of breaking drive shafts, etc. from power far beyond what the components were designed to take.. It's never a matter of just "dropping" a bigger (heavier) & powerful engine in.... To think that's the best solution is completely missing the point of what can make an AE86 a very special car... It can be a pretty good way of going about ruining an AE86 IMHO unless done right.

An unreliable high power car's far less useful than a reliable lower powered one...

[Rasteirinho]

I think it's cheaper to fit a S2K engine...

[apardal]

Already working in my friend gon's car. Staged Injection.





A small and poor quality video.

http://s287.photobucket.com/albums/ll129...V00022.flv

[robokill]

Well the topic started from one of my brain waves (or actually got cut from one of my brain waves) Lets see what hapopens when my engine is done

[gon]

"ghetto" staged injection
it working quite well though

[Miguel - Newera]

Better remove the mesh on those ITB's.... It'll seriously kill power at highest rpm. Try a before and after test.

[gon]

Miguel: it's the minimum I can do for engine protection ....
can't use any normal air filter and I'm sure those are way more restrictive

[Miguel - Newera]

You'd be surprised how much power these can sap - as well as the induction noise they'll take away from a well tuned engine.

I tried similar mesh filters (From Jubiride) for about 10 minutes and it felt like I lost around 15 bhp at top end - so I took them off and never used them again. Mesh gave about the same power loss as the K&N style filters also available from Jubiride...
Those too languish in our garage, only used every two years to quieten the intake for Shaken (MOT) with a bung up the exhaust and some tweaks to reduce emissions. Soon as that's over the filters get relegated to storage again and the engine's allowed th breathe a sign of relief!

Protection wise, coarse mesh will do virtually nothing as far as filtration goes anyways... A plate beneath the funnels to protect against dirt coming from beneath together with the original (Or better) under tray will provide greater protection against dirt and allow the engine to breathe properly through the ITB's.

If you really want to have filters, why not add some foam socks which can easily be pulled off when desired. Or if you want to minimise power loss with filtration perhaps make as large an air box out of corregated plastic board large as possible, with a large integrated foam filter. Seen this used in AE86 N2 racing with decent success...

Perhaps take a look at DTM carbon airboxes for BMW race engines http://www.s14power.com which run with ITB's for inspiration... Carbon makes a great resonant sound for air boxes, BTW... Look out for the sound clip

[apardal]

But Miguel, he has the staged injection issue. Either he would place a "larger than everything else" filter or he would be spraying gasoline directly to the foam.

Do you have your setup fully opened?

I wouldn't have a goodnight sleep with the possibility of ruining my technoprospirits engine in my mind.

Best regards