Is drifting really faster?

[Apolan]

it really depends on the type of the corner, type of the car and surface. some corner are driven fasterr by drifting (initial drift) to position the car right for the turn in. drifting after the apex is usually a speed killer. unles the corner is slow&tight and some powerful MR cars (or cars with a lot of grip) can drift abit also at the exit turning better and accelarating.

even keiichi said in drifting bible that he usually drifts the last corrner on one track in the championship. (dont eggzactly know which track). he was refering to hi speed lift-off or dynamic drifting as he called it.

so i think sometimes drifting is faster. but usually not. thou in ae86 special 2 when keiichi was doing a time atack on sugo i think, he was drifting quite a lot as Dogs Danglies mentioned.

i think drifting might be more useful w/ MR cars..

PS: formula 1 does drift! watch the slo-mo's.. even now when when they have all this electronics and downforce... in history when mechanical grip was on the hi and downforce wasnt exploited so heavily, cars drifted almost every corner.. it was faster. well this is boud to come back into formula 1 in 2007 or 2008 as the rules will change drastically. slicks are also coming back. the return of the "mechanical" grip. F1 will become more exciting, more difficult, more dangerous. cooool. =)

[banpei]

Apolan Wrote:PS: formula 1 does drift! watch the slo-mo's.. even now when when they have all this electronics and downforce... in history when mechanical grip was on the hi and downforce wasnt exploited so heavily, cars drifted almost every corner.. it was faster. well this is boud to come back into formula 1 in 2007 or 2008 as the rules will change drastically. slicks are also coming back. the return of the "mechanical" grip. F1 will become more exciting, more difficult, more dangerous. cooool. =)

The "drifts" you see in the re-runs are mostly whenever they already exited the corner and driver over the curbstones on the outside of the exit. The curbstones don't have as much grip as the asphalt and thus the car is loosing grip which results in a small tail-slide. This has nothing to do with drifting.

I do agree in the 60s and 70s a lot of F1 cars used to slide now and then due to lack of downforce, grip and having tight corners at the circuit but they never really drifted on purpose: don't forget drifting with a high powered light car without sufficient grip is taking a huge risk if you want to win a race which is all about speed: you can easialy spin and loose the race.

Also, back in the late 80s till late 90s the drivers hardly ever slided, drove with a lot of downforce and since the late 90s most tracks have changed so much that the corners are even wider (due to regulations).

I don't think we will see a combination between F1 and D1 in the upcoming seasons.

[Apolan]

the drifts i was refering to are small slips keeping the revs and speed up. im not saying F1 is doing 90' degree drifts. somebody already mentioned that car has optimum "grip" at 15% or so sliding..

[Lauren]

El_Camino Wrote:10x for the answers guys!

How would you comment this opinion in the context ot the friction circle

Quote:Maximum traction actually occurs with a slight amount of tire slippage against the rough asphalt surface. Maximum braking occurs at 10 to 15% slippage, and maximum cornering occurs at 5 to 10% slippage, as proven by numerous engineering studies and daily racing team computer datalogging records. This maximum grip occurs because the rubber in the tire is being torn away by the extreme forces involved, although the tire must be rotating to achieve this grip.

Does it means a bit of slip is good - but to dificult, do no driver can keep it on every surface?

the quickest way through a corner is to drive at the tyres optimum slip angle whilst using the steering as little as possible. What you effectively end up with is a slight 4 wheel drift as the car runs wide to the exit of the corner, so by steering slightly with the throttle you can get the power on earlier and have the steering wheel straight whilst actually sliding neutrally with all 4 wheels to the exit.

[Darkstar]

EDIT: Well guys, this is my first post over here, so I'm just saying HELLO! I'm searching for my very own Hachi right now...

Apolan Wrote:even keiichi said in drifting bible that he usually drifts the last corrner on one track in the championship. (dont eggzactly know which track). he was refering to hi speed lift-off or dynamic drifting as he called it.

I beleive he was reffering to the Fuji Speedway. I just can't imagine how he did it - from what I remember, the last corner is going uphil. It might have been another one (100R?). Anyway, sometimes drifting IS advantageous for the car's speed. From my own experience in driving during the winter, oversteer can help you in some situations... Let's take a snowy square for example.

Imagine a mid-sized square - it's been snowing for a week already. The first layer of snow was pressed to the ground by another one, which has fallen yesterday. The surface is flat. In one corner of the square, you put two pylons - that's the place you're going to start from. Somewhere in the middle of it, there are two pylons, about 30 or 40 meters from each other. You start, go around one pylon trying to grip, and around the other one you slide, even using the handbrake (doesn't matter what kind of technique you will use to initiate the slide). All you have to do is to make 5 ovals like that.

You instantly notice one very important thing - even though the Hachi isn't a very front-biased car, it's going to have trouble with understeer when trying to grip-drive. There's simply no way the car would behave neutrally, if you try to push it hard of course. It's possible to slide at the exit, when already heading to the other pylon, but that only wastes time, because as soon as you go through the midpont of the corner (let's say, "the pylon hairpin") you've got to accelerate as fast as you can, and head to the other corner immidiately.

Now let's look at the second pylon - let's say you start sliding in the right point, AFTER you turn in (you can use the handbrake to initiate that). You go tightly around the pylon, and stop sliding when you pass the midpoint. That way, you're not going to lose time trying to power oversteer the car when it understeers.

I suppose this scenario would also be applicable to other loose surfaces, such as gravel...