A new plan 4AGZE

[Bean]

ditn Wrote:Yes but then you arent allowed to drive with the car anymore.
Mine is still a legal a legal road car.

I dont for rally but i do for track.
Im kinda in an impossible spot almost

well assuming you'll get the 160hp out of the original SC setup, you could reach this with an NA build too.

either way what you are aiming for would be fairly complicated to hide away and running up to technical check at rallies and inspection hoping they'll pass it can't be nice. The whole SC setup should raise enough cash to buy some good cams and cam gears and the rest you should be able to afford by the money you save not needing another gearbox.

If money is less of an issue, what I doubt, you might want to consider to get another car.

[ditn]

Maybe, 160 would probably 270+cams which might get spotted also
there is also the other problem that im in love with superchargers after i have seen my very first ae86 with and had to luck to be a passenger for a little bit.


For rallies i would remove the sc al together,then it will look like a normal 4AGE

this is my aim

http://forums.club4ag.com/zerothread?id=53427
last post

Selling the ae86 will never happen.

forgive my stubbornness

[Bean]

ditn Wrote:Maybe, 160 would probably 270+cams which might get spotted also
there is also the other problem that im in love with superchargers after i have seen my very first ae86 with and had to luck to be a passenger for a little bit.


For rallies i would remove the sc al together,then it will look like a normal 4AGE

this is my aim


Selling the ae86 will never happen.

forgive my stubbornness

You wouldn't need cams that wild with proper CR. Seems you are sold to the idea so I wish you good luck. No need to forgive, I built many cars and changed my mind/plans more often than I would have wished for.

And never said to sell it, rather buy a second or FT86 for daily/track

[ditn]

thanks,i will do my best

I already have 2 cars taxing my bank account.
The second one is a peugeot 106 gti,and i can't get it over my heart to sell that one,i like it to much.

[corolla4agze]

mine z is getting NA model intake lot better than stock. And easy hp from there also. Piping is lot better to z install on RWD car etc.
But every one make way they want to.

[ditn]

If im correct then the abv release air back to the sc intake if the the throttle is 5 seconds or more released right?

i would make it like he did

air filter => sc => intercooler in => intercooler out =>intake manifold
and then try to figure something out with abv/wastegate so that when you lift the throttle for +5 sec that the intake from the sc will be shut and another tube directly to the intake manifold would be used.

I think shuting the abv might be dangerous?
=>fuel econ
=>cooling,gets alot hotter without the abv
=>wear

Also i know its possible to command the sc with a switch,i have seen a movie of it.Trying to find out more

btw this looks odd

[ditn]

some very good information here

To explain the ABV: when supercharger is engaged and throttle is shut, high vacuum in the plenum pulls the abv open creating a recirculating circuit through the SC. once throttle is pressed.. depending on intake vacuum the ABV gradually closes which directs more and more air into the engine until the ABV is fully closed creating pressure in the intake plenum. as you back off the throttle, the intake is under vacuum again which open the bypass circuit allowing the charger to spin freely. the ABV is held shut by a spring rated at the maximum boost pressure which will allow the ABV to open once full boost is reached (8-10psi in factory 4agze system). this is a safety mechanism to relieve any overboost.
The toyota system also has a time delay (5secs?) of full vacuum before the charger is disengaged via the electromagnetic clutch (so it doesn't cut the SC whilst changing gears etc). The clutch is re-engaged at 8" of vacuum, ie when throttle is pressed.
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The best bypass/recirculating valve to use is an external wastegate off a turbo as these use a diaphragm operated valve which is smooth in operation. (tho expensive) an external wastegate measures the difference in pressure before and after the throttle. The air line connected after the throttle is attached to top of the wastegate actuator so it pulls the valve open.. the air line before the throttle connects on the underside of wastegate diaphragm so any pressure before the throttle helps open the bypass valve. Unlike a BOV (blow off valve) which is designed to open and close suddenly and harshly which can cause flutters and other issues so is not suited as a ABV.
Using a BOV solely to release air to atmosphere from the SC system is both noisy and a waste of power/petrol. imagine your sitting at idle and your engine is constantly pissing air! it WILL get annoying.

[Lauren]

Good info on the ABV there. I'd throw the ABV or just block it off. I ran an SC with a Fensport pulley and got an outlet pipe for the supercharger made up without the ABV.

That way you get all the boost pressure and don't lose any.

The Supercharger won't overboost anyway as it's belt driven, so there is no risk of that.

I've run a car like this pushing out 186bhp reliably over a three year period and have done at least I would say 30 trackdays (I used to work for a trackday company) and 35000 miles as well. I sold the engine in 2006 and last I heard somewhere around 2010 it was still going strong, so you really don't need an ABV and it's not worth messing about with wastegates and the like as the terminal speed of the supercharger is set by the pulley size.

About the only real difference I noted with no ABV was that when the supercharger clutch was engaged it wasn't quite as smooth a transition, but can't say that ever bothered me tbh.

I've got a fully rebuilt blueprinted 4AGZE awaiting to go in my car, though I am going to remove all the supercharger stuff and go turbo as it's much more efficient. Whilst an SC in an AE86 will be quick, using big pulleys does take the SC way beyond it's operating rpm really and the result is that it significantly heats the air, so becomes a bit of a hair dryer. Also worth noting is that no new parts can be got for an SC12. All said and done, they do tend to be reliable units to be fair. I just want to go turbo because I've done the whole SC thing.

If you would like further info on all things SC, my fiance and I run a supercharger forum that was based around the AW11. There is a lot of expertise there. Send me a PM and I'll give you the link.

[asyrigos]

I have also a rebuilt 4AGZE that was supposed to be used with a turbo but snatched a Blitz supercharger kit to install instead.

I'd be interested in reviewing your forum and the posts there around SC and 4AGZE.

The good thing about this Blitz kit is that you can easily swap a smaller pulley on the supercharger as there is no magnetic clutch. No need for a set of pulleys for crank, water pump etc.

We intend to use water injection for controlling air's temperature going into the engine.

[ditn]

I have sent you a pm

The reason i wanted the wastegaste is because i heard it improved
cooling and smooth operation+antiwear.

So the supercharger was on at the track all the time and you had no heat/wear problems?

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It prevents the blower from heating up when idling and otherwise in vac. Its also otherwise less tress on the blower and engine having it not creating a real pressure differential between the blower plenum and the manifold. I would run one, its 2 pounds of weight onto the car tops and its going to keep heat out of the blower. Downside is that you dont get sweet sweet blower whine at idle, only when on throttle.
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Im a big supercharger fan
Im not really planning on using another pulley because i will be using the 4AGZE ecu and 10 psi is the max it can handle

I know its possible for a switch to put the sc on and off,but i cant find info on it.This would be used for saving fuel and when the sc is not needed.
or is the ecu smart enough that i dont need this?
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The bypass is only useful at part throttle, as it closes once your foot goes down. For that reason, I plan to run a VSV on the supercharger switch in parallel with a single vacuum line with check valve. When the VSV is closed, that line only sees vacuum and holds the valve open. When I flip the switch for the blower, it now sees boost and holds the valve shut. N/A I can have the thing floored and still not be restricted. This will also allow me to adjust the BPV down to let it close earlier and hopefully get more resolution from the throttle. Something to consider if running a blow through setup. I'd venture to say that the rotor clearances are the same for both, hence the SC14's lower redline.
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